Episode 202: Gillian Callahan Chachere

[Jimmy]

I love you Paul and I don't want to discount anyone's pain, but miscarriages? Really Paul? Both my mother and ex-wife had miscarriages and they were both very painful experiences, but next to the issues discussed in the rest of the podcasts, miscarriages are a joke. Some of us listeners are hanging on to life by a thread for Christ's sake and listening to otherwise healthy women complain about losing a baby seems genuinely trivial. I'm starting to question whether I belong here.

[marzipan]

I was extremely touched by this episode and thought it was one of the most intense stories in recent memory. I'm surprised that anyone could listen all the way through and say such cruel things. I'm assuming that you're a cis male, Jimmy. Perhaps because you don't have a uterus, you can't wrap your head around the incredible trauma of walking around with a dead fetus inside of you for a week. A fetus that has been dead for another whole week, a fetus that you were already considering your child, to whom you've been singing and speaking, for whom you've already bought a book of baby names.

I've never wanted to be a mother, but I do menstruate and have a certain connection to my body in that way. I never imagined how painful this situation could be but somehow I can almost imagine the terrible loss and grief as Gillian describes it. I almost cried a few times during this episode. I'm glad that abortion was discussed with such nuance as well.

I also gained even more respect for "body work" and a stronger belief that this kind of therapy would work for my own trauma. I recommend that anyone read "A Revolutionary Approach to Treating PTSD" on NYTimes.com - it could change your mind about the sort of therapies that may help you. Trauma is so clearly stored in the body, and strong emotions are often stored away too when we struggle with depression and anxiety, but we rarely think about treating the body as well as the mind. This episode was a great example of how alternative healing can help. I loved that. Whatever works for you is valid, even if it's embarrassing new-age shit. I'm looking forward to seeking out a therapist like the one in the article that I mentioned, if possible, once I'm struggling less financially.

Anyway... kindly STFU. Saying "I don't want to discount anyone's pain" is kinda like having to say "I'm not racist, but..." Her trauma is valid. Don't silence her, or people like her, with such belittling statements. People don't have to be on a cliff's edge to deserve compassion, support, and treatment.

Actually, my only complaint with this episode was Paul comparing Gillian's miscarriages not once, but twice to the trauma that soldiers feel. He kept forcing the point and it was such a crass comparison and truly made me go WTF.

[fifthsonata]

It's easy to discredit something you can't understand, nor will you be able to understand until you've experienced it yourself. I should be surprised to see such a callous comment come out of a member on this forum, but this is the internet and it's too easy to say hurtful things. There is no way you'll be able to understand until you've carried around a child in your body - or rather, carry a dead baby in your body - so don't be so quick to judge. Do you possibly understand the changes a woman's body goes through during pregnancy? Do you understand the feeling of postpartum depression? How in the fuck can you pass judgement on something you haven't experienced? You have no idea what it can do to someone, and in many cases, how it leads a mother to end her life. Just because your mom or your ex had a miscarriage and were able to move on (to your knowledge, anyway, I doubt they told you the full extent of their feelings) doesn't mean they represent the entirety of women.

I'm going to stop now because I'm feeling incredible rage build up. Everyone has their own experiences, and the comment you just made does nothing but propagate more stigma. Either don't listen to episodes like this or try to open your eyes up a little and give women a little respect by showing some empathy.

[ghughes1980]

Jimmy, dude, seriously? That's not trivial. When ever your body betrays you it's important.

[ghughes1980]

The therapy exercise with the baby in the palm sounds very similar to to some of the treatments I've done over that last few months in Acceptance therapy. These are very helpful and I was really in the moment as Gillian was relaying that experience.

[gfyourself]

Sort of a meta awfulsome moment where I listened to the episode, thought it was quite good, would give comfort to women with such issues that perhaps find it difficult to find support elsewhere. Then, I come here and I see "...miscarriages. Really, Paul?" I had to laugh.

Anyhow, I thought this was quite a good episode. I liked what Gillian said about "choosing not to live in shame" (I paraphrase).

[Superman]

This was a great episode!i'm a 28-year-old male and I'm not afraid to say that this episode did make me cry. My wife she is pregnant she's due any day now. This is her second and my first. It's been hard for me to think about connecting to a growing life inside her and hearing this episode makes me thinkabout what kind of person she's going to be there sometimes where you can see little personality traitswhen I come home I start talking to my wife that's when the baby is the most active in her stomach they're all these life events that I feel are happening as she's growing in there that are defining who she's going to bethat are making her person. Gillian is a hero in my eyes she had so much strength even just the strength to reach out and ask for help even though she didn't fully believe that she found the benefits and is able to let go it's beautiful and amazing and even though she might not ever have kids she is a good motherbecause she is able to educate so many other people And help them feel like they're not alone.