Episode 163: Loneliness – Mini-Episode w/ Dr. Guy Winch - Se

[CleverSometimes]

This episode came at the perfect time for me, and it had some good advice and some solid tools, but here's where I'm getting stuck: I have spent the past year making a concerted effort to get out of the house more, ask people to grab coffee, see movies etc, and often feel good when I do get out... trouble is that it is ALWAYS me initiating the social activities. I'm well liked, so I know in theory i'm not bothering people, but I'm really sick of always being the initiator, the coordinator etc.. part of me hopes it will get better with the brutal east coast winter going away, but I feel the need to stay very on top of my social activities, because i get lonely very easily.

I live alone in a major city and am dysthymic if that puts any of this in context.

How do I keep my momentum going without getting frustrated and resenting my friends for not reciprocating? I've tried supplementing my activities by trying to meet new people through things like meetup.com. any other advice?

I loved his advice of getting a pet, but unfortunately I'm allergic, which kills me because I think it really would make me feel alot better when I'm at home.

[Paul Gilmartin]

My suggestion would be to remember that other people are probably dealing with what you do but don't have the tools or willingness to pick up the phone and initiate plans. And keep in mind that by encouraging other people to socialize you are providing a service. You are giving. The byproduct of that is that you "get". You get to feel more connected. The world needs you more than you think.

Hug,

Paul

[CleverSometimes]

Thank you Paul! I'll keep at it.

Hugs to you too!

[Cheezy]

I have diagnosed dysthymia and Avoidant Personality Disorder, and am a shut-in, so I feel I can relate to you in some ways. You're doing better than I am. I can't even get myself out of the house and be social, let alone resent being the constant coordinator. So I can't exactly give you advice lol. But just wondering, are you and these other people in contact on Facebook? What I hate about it is that it's very invasive for people like me, but it's great for social people, knowing who's too busy and who's able to go out.

I agree with Paul about you doing the right thing by initiating contact and encouraging people to go out. I am much more likely to agree to go out with someone than to be the one to initiate it. I wish I knew people like you! I could only hope someone would care enough to bug me to go out. Even then, I'm reluctant to. Though frustrating, you're doing the right thing and it doesn't mean you're failing. In fact, just by asking people out, you're showing that you care enough to ask and that you still exist in their world.

Good luck and keep us updated.

[Hail Ceasar]

I LOVED Guy's suggested reasoning for why a friend may not have "liked" your picture on Facebook; reason being perhaps their hands were tied and literally couldn't do it. Haha, it's crazy how we immediately jump to the conclusion that our friends hate or just tolerate us instead.

[GrumpyZhukov]

On a tangent from the general thrust of the conversation, I wonder if I am alone with my reaction to one of the points which was raised? It was the idea that loneliness is contagious, that lonely people, by spending time with them, can 'bring others down' so to speak.

A little background: I've had depression for the 'best' part of 7 years now and I have regularly feared alienating my friends by being a downer. When feeling especially low I have, in the past, deliberately shielded them by isolating myself for fear of testing their patience. Yes, I would feel worse but I consider friendship a finite resource of units (I know I shouldn't but there it is). You gain units by going to parties, dinners and good evenings with good conversations and laughter. You lose units by being sad or low, or missing appointments/parties - the point is friendship is finite - and it's also a very fucked up and warped way of thinking about friendship; but there we are .

What I was disconcerted about was that the podcast seemed to legitimise my belief that when feeling lonely I should isolate myself to protect those I care about, even if I'm doing it to preserve their friendships for my benefit. But as was also discussed, this only makes matters worse. There seemed to be a gulf between being lonely and socialising raising questions like, "Is it okay to say if I'm feeling unhappy?", "Should I make sure I'm wearing my "I'm Fine!' mask when socialising so as not to 'drain' people?". Simply, you should steer clear of the lonely because they'll only 'bring you down'. But I'm sure this can't have been the intended message.

A friend called H said something to me recently which really revolutionised how I saw this problem. H is currently studying for his doctorate in Psychology. I told him I felt reluctant to be honest about my feelings sometimes because I was very wary about boring/upsetting/infecting him with my loneliness and depression. I remember very clearly that he smiled and shook his head and this is what he said, paraphrased:

Mate, when I hang up the phone after a conversation where you've said how difficult things are, this is what I feel. I feel sad that you are struggling and I want to find a way I could help you. But I also feel honoured that you feel you can trust me with this stuff. It's a privilege to be allowed such a level of insight into your life. So for a few minutes I feel sad but then I get on with my own life, I might talk about how your doing with my wife whilst preparing dinner or have my daily evening bath with lighted candles and read a journal paper [don't ask but he does this every evening after work for at least 15 minutes!]. So mate, you don't have to worry about 'infecting' or 'polluting' me with sadness. Instead you have to be careful, like everybody else in the world about being boring! If you talked for two hours straight about a single incident between you and your brother I'd say, "Okay, but let's change the subject for a bit". But everyone has to watch this, mate, not just you! Our friend C can talk forever about cabinet making and I nearly always have to interrupt him after an hour because there is only so much interest one can muster about brass hinges! And you are socially adept enough that I've never felt I've had to say that to you once - unless it's when your trying to get me listen to various podcasts [which, in fairness, is quite true!] when you know I'm a TV kind of guy! So you've got nothing to worry about, mate.

In one stroke this changed the way I thought - I don't have to worry about polluting people with my depression because I'm some 'special case' - I only need to be aware of boring people which makes me feel the same as everyone else rather than some singular depressive who brings people down.

Perhaps I missed the thrust of the podcast but if I had a recommendation for anyone it would be not to worry about infecting people with sadness and say you can discuss you feelings but not for two hours straight on one single point/issue . But even this 'rule' is flexible, of course!

Hope this might be helpful to people. Take care,

GZ