Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 15th, 2020, 10:44 am
Do you feel any tension between self-compassion and self-improvement?
Yes, I do.
What about you, Manuel Moe? What’s going on?
YOU ARE NOT ALONE - A companion online community discussion board for The Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast with Paul Gilmartin
Postings on this site are NOT by mental health professionals, rather the opinions & experiences of a community of regular people. If you feel like you are going to hurt yourself or others PLEASE call Suicide Prevention at 1-800-273-8255
https://mentalpodforum.com/
Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Page 1 of 1
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 15th, 2020, 4:17 pm
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 15th, 2020, 6:49 pm
Yes, I do, Manuel Moe! Absolutely and all the time. I'm here to listen if you have something going on that you'd like to share.
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 16th, 2020, 8:40 am
Hi Oak, Hi Tony!
Yeah, reading my posts here from 7 years ago, one of the things i was fighting with, that i still fight with, is that when i was young i thought i was going to be great, to really shine, to really be exceptional.
Not so much, as i turn from 49 years old to 50.
( 
)
i have a vision, i have goals and dreams, but the person who could actually achieve those goals and dreams is a person with a very different constitution than i have. i am lazy, i am a time-waster, my mind is muddy a lot of the time, i get so sleepy, i nearly collapse from chemical depression a lot of the time. Heck, even showering is a fraught activity, other people can just jump in the shower and clean themselves efficiently, while i suffer because my depression and anxiety is triggered in the shower, and i must leave my usual distractions outside the shower stall, and just suffer. i am in mental anguish, and i am moving my body against resistance from chemical depression.
...
i used to day-dream in the shower for most of my life. i used to day-dream of what would happen after achieving my goals in the shower for most of my life, imagining praise and triumph and adulation as the warm water splashed on me. but that was childish, dreaming of the achievement without doing the work actually makes you lose steam you need to really achieve the goals in the really-existing world. you get a fraudulent charge from day-dreaming and imagining, and it short-circuits motivation that you need to really, actually achieve. better to work and get a charge from working when it is difficult, and pressing-on.
my heroes are addicted to the daily grind of actually getting the work done. not like me.
(think about stephen king writing, and linus torvalds programming. these are doers. not like me.)
...
i know self-compassion is a part of the puzzle... i have tried self-hatred intensely and often in my past, doesn't work. i can't self-hate myself into the person i want to be, it just leads to breakdown and collapse.
so i am practicing self-compassion and kinda getting better at it. but does accepting myself mean that i lose the motivation to strive to improve? Hmm...
...
when i arrive at an apparent contradiction in leading a moral, fulfilling life, i know what to do. i synthesize the contradicting points into single ying-yang, and then i know i must take the route of greater moral courage. so what does that look like?
https://www.becomingwhoyouare.net/blog/ ... mprovement this is a very interesting blog post. she says that self-compassion and self-improvement are different parts of the idea of self-regard. so what does self-regard look like?
i will keep practicing self-compassion & self-acceptance. in my rational mind i will turn my goals and dreams into plans, and break my plans into steps, and do those steps in a balanced way as best i can.
the "as best i can" part is the tricky part. right now, "as best i can" is pretty pitiful. pitiful enough that it triggers depression. hmm.
...
the "moral courage" part means drawing in a breath and pressing on, not being afraid to put my goals and dreams on paper and put the plans to achieve those goals and dreams on paper too. The fear is real, being serious about my goals and dreams and then arriving at failure means... ... it means then i am a failure.
No, "i am a failure" is a illogical sentence. taking steps toward a worthy goal makes you a success already at the first step, logically.
(dammit, but annoying voice in the back of my head isn't logical, and it is terrified of having it be plain as day that i am a failure, so it retreats into day-dream world)
...
ok, well, compared to 7 years ago, i have better tools and greater vision of the whole landscape. i seem to have less chemical depression (god, i hope it doesn't come back
)
...
did i even say anything of worth? what do you think about all this? i will come back to this, this was a particularly raw brain-dump.
Yeah, reading my posts here from 7 years ago, one of the things i was fighting with, that i still fight with, is that when i was young i thought i was going to be great, to really shine, to really be exceptional.
Not so much, as i turn from 49 years old to 50.
( )i have a vision, i have goals and dreams, but the person who could actually achieve those goals and dreams is a person with a very different constitution than i have. i am lazy, i am a time-waster, my mind is muddy a lot of the time, i get so sleepy, i nearly collapse from chemical depression a lot of the time. Heck, even showering is a fraught activity, other people can just jump in the shower and clean themselves efficiently, while i suffer because my depression and anxiety is triggered in the shower, and i must leave my usual distractions outside the shower stall, and just suffer. i am in mental anguish, and i am moving my body against resistance from chemical depression.
...
i used to day-dream in the shower for most of my life. i used to day-dream of what would happen after achieving my goals in the shower for most of my life, imagining praise and triumph and adulation as the warm water splashed on me. but that was childish, dreaming of the achievement without doing the work actually makes you lose steam you need to really achieve the goals in the really-existing world. you get a fraudulent charge from day-dreaming and imagining, and it short-circuits motivation that you need to really, actually achieve. better to work and get a charge from working when it is difficult, and pressing-on.
my heroes are addicted to the daily grind of actually getting the work done. not like me.
(think about stephen king writing, and linus torvalds programming. these are doers. not like me.)
...
i know self-compassion is a part of the puzzle... i have tried self-hatred intensely and often in my past, doesn't work. i can't self-hate myself into the person i want to be, it just leads to breakdown and collapse.
so i am practicing self-compassion and kinda getting better at it. but does accepting myself mean that i lose the motivation to strive to improve? Hmm...
...
when i arrive at an apparent contradiction in leading a moral, fulfilling life, i know what to do. i synthesize the contradicting points into single ying-yang, and then i know i must take the route of greater moral courage. so what does that look like?
https://www.becomingwhoyouare.net/blog/ ... mprovement this is a very interesting blog post. she says that self-compassion and self-improvement are different parts of the idea of self-regard. so what does self-regard look like?
i will keep practicing self-compassion & self-acceptance. in my rational mind i will turn my goals and dreams into plans, and break my plans into steps, and do those steps in a balanced way as best i can.
the "as best i can" part is the tricky part. right now, "as best i can" is pretty pitiful. pitiful enough that it triggers depression. hmm.
...
the "moral courage" part means drawing in a breath and pressing on, not being afraid to put my goals and dreams on paper and put the plans to achieve those goals and dreams on paper too. The fear is real, being serious about my goals and dreams and then arriving at failure means... ... it means then i am a failure.
No, "i am a failure" is a illogical sentence. taking steps toward a worthy goal makes you a success already at the first step, logically.
(dammit, but annoying voice in the back of my head isn't logical, and it is terrified of having it be plain as day that i am a failure, so it retreats into day-dream world)
...
ok, well, compared to 7 years ago, i have better tools and greater vision of the whole landscape. i seem to have less chemical depression (god, i hope it doesn't come back
)...
did i even say anything of worth? what do you think about all this? i will come back to this, this was a particularly raw brain-dump.
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 16th, 2020, 10:11 am
Hi Manuel Moe!
I want to start by saying that I hear you! I see all of this pain because it is inside me, too. The "self-hate myself to greatness" bit really hit home for me.
It's very interesting that you post this because I was _literally_ just contemplating all of this on my run this morning so you're definitely _not_ alone in this. Without doing the "make it about me" thing, I want to share a perspective on the "baby steps" part that you mentioned. I am not going to try to convince you of anything, just share what I came up with for myself. Take what you want and leave the rest...
For myself, I used to be a competitive runner. It all started when I was ~50+ pounds overweight and I set the goal of running a half marathon. I was way out of shape and there was no way I would run a race like that the next day. So, I had to set small incremental goals. First, just complete running 1 mile, regardless of time. Then, 2 miles, then 5 miles. Then, start running for a particular pace. It was all cumulative and the goals were small, incremental, and achievable. If I had tried to run the half-marathon on day 1 I would have failed, been disappointed, and gave up. But, I worked incrementally and achieved what I wanted.
The mental health journey is just like this for me. I identified 4 things that I want to work on in my life. (1) self compassion, (2) negative self talk, (3) unhealthy compulsive behavior such as my relationship with food, (4) toning down caffeine intake as it is an anxiety/depression trigger for me. Then, I worked on how I can work on these things incrementally.
I don't know if this will resonate for you but I hope that it does. I am really nervous writing this because I don't want it to be seen as me trying to take your pain and make it about me. That's not my goal. And I'm certainly not trying to be a "fixer" for what is so obviously a lot of internal conflict and pain for you. All I am trying to do is share that you're not alone with a concrete example and perhaps share an alternative perspective that might help you see light at the end of the tunnel.
P.S. I am feeling totally in my codependency about that last paragraph.
I want to start by saying that I hear you! I see all of this pain because it is inside me, too. The "self-hate myself to greatness" bit really hit home for me.
It's very interesting that you post this because I was _literally_ just contemplating all of this on my run this morning so you're definitely _not_ alone in this. Without doing the "make it about me" thing, I want to share a perspective on the "baby steps" part that you mentioned. I am not going to try to convince you of anything, just share what I came up with for myself. Take what you want and leave the rest...
For myself, I used to be a competitive runner. It all started when I was ~50+ pounds overweight and I set the goal of running a half marathon. I was way out of shape and there was no way I would run a race like that the next day. So, I had to set small incremental goals. First, just complete running 1 mile, regardless of time. Then, 2 miles, then 5 miles. Then, start running for a particular pace. It was all cumulative and the goals were small, incremental, and achievable. If I had tried to run the half-marathon on day 1 I would have failed, been disappointed, and gave up. But, I worked incrementally and achieved what I wanted.
The mental health journey is just like this for me. I identified 4 things that I want to work on in my life. (1) self compassion, (2) negative self talk, (3) unhealthy compulsive behavior such as my relationship with food, (4) toning down caffeine intake as it is an anxiety/depression trigger for me. Then, I worked on how I can work on these things incrementally.
I don't know if this will resonate for you but I hope that it does. I am really nervous writing this because I don't want it to be seen as me trying to take your pain and make it about me. That's not my goal. And I'm certainly not trying to be a "fixer" for what is so obviously a lot of internal conflict and pain for you. All I am trying to do is share that you're not alone with a concrete example and perhaps share an alternative perspective that might help you see light at the end of the tunnel.
P.S. I am feeling totally in my codependency about that last paragraph.
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 16th, 2020, 10:15 am
Hi Tony!
Your post was like sunshine on my face. Thanks for listening and posting.
Your post was like sunshine on my face. Thanks for listening and posting.
Re: Tension between self-compassion and self-improvement
Posted: June 16th, 2020, 10:33 am
Manuel, I so related to the part about daydreaming in the shower and how unproductive it is.