YOU ARE NOT ALONE - A companion online community discussion board for The Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast with Paul Gilmartin

Today, I thought seriously about picking up my laptop and working on one of my programming projects.

I eventually decided to do some mending, sew some buttons, steam some clothes that I’m thrilled about fitting into again, but realistically, I don’t even know if I will ever wear them. I never leave the house.

I am so confused and lost. I don’t have anyone to talk to about this.

The thing that stops me from going back to programming is, I don’t see what the point is. I’m only interested in my favorite project, an app that started out as an assignment for the full stack program I took last year. It’s a database of all the countries, and the assignment was to make it searchable, and display details for any selected country, such as an image of the flag, the current weather conditions, etc.

But once I got my app working with their minimum requirements, I found myself obsessed with adding more information and features. It’s something I am actually very interested in, learning more about the countries in the world, and the last time I worked on it, I was trying to add maps, which I was about to give up on, because it’s a lot harder than it should be… lol.

I have lots more ideas, however, that seem like they should be doable. Like gdp, UN membership, politics maybe…

But I have no idea what I would do with it, even if I eventually get all the features I want built.

Any ideas or advice, or questions on this subject are welcome.

Man, don't let any bullshit stand between you and programming. It is an art form.

Ugh, everyday I should be coding... ...and I let every bullshit little reason get in my way.

Take care, RightInTwo, we are cheering for you.

Ha, well, I guess I forgot to mention another reason why I’m hesitating.

This is how it was before I took a break: I’d sit down in front of my computer, sometimes immediately upon waking & having breakfast, start coding, and the next thing I knew, it would be 5:00 pm, time to start dinner. I hadn’t even showered. Day after day after day…. (not the shower part lol) I got a lot of coding done, but sometimes a whole day would pass with nothing but fruitless google searches for an extremely specific error or problem I was having, which always left me emotionally drained and feeling utterly “stupid.” Like, who am I kidding, this problem should have been solved in like 5 minutes if I was a ~real~ programmer.

Even when I had productive days, the house became an utter disaster, the dirt and fur from 6 pets accumulated to nightmare proportions, because I just couldn’t bring myself to do anything but code.

So, clearly, I don’t have any problem with motivation to code; on the contrary, it’s almost like an addiction for me, and I’m not sure if I can re-engage in a healthier way. Suggestions such as, “set a timer to stop & get up” are about as helpful as telling a substance abuser to “just substitute chewing gum” or some bullshit like that. I already know I won’t do it, or, even if I do, it won’t be enough to actually balance things out.

Another question: Is there any way for me to get a realistic evaluation of my skill level? I wish I could find a fun, friendly coding community, specifically for MERN stack, where I could learn how to work with other people. I’ve been told to find a repo on github to contribute to, but the very idea of asking a bunch of total strangers - who I assume are light years ahead of my skill level - gives me a full on panic attack.

I would just continue as you are. I also am not a real programmer: I code way too slow and careful and I need to take breaks to recharge. The world goes 'round on the backs of people like you and me: not really competent to compete but good enough. I have to remind myself of that.

Cheers!

“good enough” is a fine and useful mantra, imo.

Having a strong tendency towards toxic levels of perfectionism, I see it as a sign of growth, if I can let myself go with “good enough.”

Where does your perfectionism come from, RightInTwo? Mine is entirely fear based: my mind plays out all the possible ways my stuff can fail in the future - it motivates me at the best of times, it overwhelms and crushes me during the worst of times

I AM CODING TODAY! And I am coding slowly, as I do. And it doesn't mean I am a bad or worthless person.

Just keep pressing on, one statement after another... even if it is like pulling teeth

RIT! I’ve read your thread, and Manuel Mod’s kind and thoughtful replies.

I’m too exhausted/grieving/HALT to give a proper response, but I want you to know that you are not alone.

Where does my perfectionism come from?

… hmmmmm …..


OCD, perhaps? At least some of it.

I’m really not sure. It’s a good question, though, something I will definitely be doing some reflection on.

It might be tied to hyper-idealism. My mind likes to find the ultimate, whatever thing or process or result, and then find out if that really is the ultimate, or does something even better exist? Just to make sure my standards are as high as they can possibly be!

It doesn’t feel like it’s coming from a negative place, rather, I get some sort of dopamine hit when something I’m doing reaches my own definition of “perfect.”

But, just because it doesn’t feel inherently negative to me, doesn’t mean that it always benefits me. I might be using it to avoid the tougher decisions facing me at any given moment.

Plus it gets me in trouble, because I end up over-focusing on one little thing, at the expense of the bigger, arguably more important objective. (I’m fairly certain that this has caused problems in previous jobs.)

The best definition of business I’ve encountered is this:

“The value must flow.”

At the moment, it sounds a little like you are perfecting avoidance. Like, how to best occupy yourself without going outside, or affecting anything outside. I think you might have control in and of your immediate environment. It’s just not giving you satisfaction to have that control. And there are only diminishing returns on refining that control. At the same time it’s vitally important that you protect something precious with your efforts.

I’m not an expert (well, maybe in practicing similar behavior) but… Imagine your efforts causing value to flow. Imagine them causing something you value, to flow; through the world.

I watched a documentary about a daughter who was to inherit a fireworks company, in Japan, that had been in her family for centuries. She went away, studied business, apprenticed in firework technique and did everything to set herself up for success.

She returned to her father with innovation and plans to make the company profitable. Her father said, “you’re not ready, you don’t get it.” Eventually, after several years, she realized that profits weren’t the goal. The value of fireworks is that they create wonder. The wonder must flow. That was the purpose of the business. That’s what drew customers. When the father saw that the daughter understood this, he gave her control of the business.

For me, I don’t really know what value I want to flow, as the result of my work. Or rather, I know, intimately, but never how to put it into words. Maybe I just need to let it flow wordlessly, for me to continue. Maybe it’s enough to know, I know, it’s there.