Spouse with HSDD

[Otter]

I'm 45, male, married for 14 years with two great kids. We have a really good/great relationship. My wife is very attractive, successful, fit and fun. We have similar interests and do lots of things together. We are affectionate out of bed. Seems like an ideal situation, right? Every few months I will break down in tears and get very sad. This happens suddenly after I have tried to make out/initiate sex. She almost always shows no response to my deeper affection (frequency? I try to get close about 1x every 3 days, on average) over a period of weeks or months. She does not initiate making out or having sex. We have sex on an average 3x month, but it is planned or agreed to. Sex is always good; I can bring her to orgasm every time. I have tried many different approaches to this, but her lack of responsiveness and no initiative on her own is very hard to deal with.

After poking around online, I found a condition in the DSM called Hypoactive Sexual Desire Disorder. The definition seems to fit our situation. Does anyone else struggle with this in their relationship? Can any mental health professionals point me toward more info or resources? I'm starting to feel hopeless and need to do something. Thank you.

[oak]

An interesting question, Otter. Thanks for posting.

For clarification, sir, do you think your wife may have this? Do I take it from your post that you are happy with your own sex drive?

As a heterosexual man, who is not a clinician, I won't speak for female sexual realities.

As a man who can elicit positive sexual responses from women, I can offer my two cents, which you are welcome to take or leave

First, I congratulate you on doing a lot right: happily married, good kids, affection, and bringing her orgasm. All commendable!

From your post, it looks like you want physcial affection/sex 3x a week, and she agrees to sex 3x a month? Is that accurate?

If so, that is a disparity. How that works in the give and take of a marriage, I have no idea.

A tough question to consider: would your wife suddenly want to have sex if Ryan Gosling were to show up at her front door?

My only suggestion would be to learn more about female sexual response. Nancy Friday's "My Secret Garden" opened my eyes. I also like the annual "Best American Erotica" series.

Female sexuality is complex and fluid, but nothing to be afraid of. Perhaps there are ways to find out what pushes your wife's buttons that will help her want to have sex more often.

Again, just my two cents. Good luck.

[Otter]

Thanks for responding, oak. Yes, it is my wife that seems to have this condition. I am happy with my sex drive. I can masturbate openly with her in bed and it's not an issue. And yes, I would prefer more often. But it's not really just sex that I want. I want to be wanted by her. I want to make out with her and get that soaring feeling. As for the Ryan Gosling thing, I don't think so, but I'll ask her. She says things like "I don't need to orgasm" and "it's just a physical act- I show you love in more important ways" I don't think she fantasizes about sex with anyone, including me. I can take it on any one occasion, but after weeks or months I just fall apart, usually no warning. It sucks, I hate feeling this way.

We have just started couples counseling at my suggestion, so I'll keep the Happy Hour world apprised of events as they unfold! I know from the show that people deal with much darker stuff than this, but the pain is so real and I feel so isolated sometimes. Thanks again for responding.

[AlmostWell]

This pain is not only real, but it is valid. We, as a culture, tend to dismiss the importance of sex. It is particularly painful to be rejected again and again from the only person who can provide you with that need. It would be like a mother denying food to her son who is saying he is hungry. I do not mean that as a loose analogy - I mean it literally. I am glad you two are seeking counseling. Just make sure that the counselor is sex positive. Many in the profession tend to see a natural male sex drive as an enemy or something gross. You can ask the question point blank: Are you sex-positive?

One question I would have is this: Has it always been this way, even from the beginning of the relationship? If so, she might be asexual. Asexuality is an actual sexual orientation, where the person is hard wired to not like sex. They like intimacy and partnering up, but not actual sex. It is not an aversion, it just doesn't register a response. Like a hetero guy in a locker room - you see the other guy's wang and you don't have any physical response at all. Asexual people just do not respond sexually to any people. Keep us updated as to what you find out. Taking the first step to get help is so important.

[Otter]

AlmostWell,

Thank you so much for your reply- It is such a relief to read your words- I can't tell you enough how much it helps. I will certainly ask the therapist about a sex-positive orientation tomorrow at our session. The therapist has asked me to write about the emotion of rejection and what it has been like to be rejected in the past. I can see how this may help me get more control/distance over my emotions so it's not so painful, but I've been clear that this is not just me being emotionally unstable. There is a real source to what is going on.

She was not always like this. It seems acquired beginning about 6 years ago. I guess it's easier to know that it's not that she doesn't want to have sex with me, she just doesn't want to have sex. The most painful part is that she is not there in the warm up period- doesn't want to make-out, feel the spark, etc.

She has said the following things in the recent past- "It's just a physical act; it doesn't mean anything. I show you my love in other ways." and "I don't need to orgasm like you"

Can you recommend a book about how to cope in a relationship like this?

Thanks again so much.

[AlmostWell]

I am so glad you are feeling some relief. BTW, I totally agree with your take on the "rejection" exercise. Will understanding your experiences of rejection help the situation for you? Unless it is used to communicate the depth of your pain to your wife, it seems strange to me.

I don't know any off the top of my head. But there is a columnist, sex advice guru , and podcaster named Dan Savage who covers this sort of thing. Dan is very openly gay, and his podcast is completely open about all manifestations of human sexuality....from missionary heterosex to hardcore fetishes only shared by very few. He also is an advocate for open relationships in cases like yours. I say this as a warning, because he challenges a LOT of our cultural sexual norms, which can make it very difficult to initially listen to. However, he is SO right on about the realities of sex (though he has 1 or 2 blind spots). Good luck man! I'm rooting for you.

[Otter]

Thanks Almost,

I know Dan Savage, he is good and really funny. I used to read his column (Savage Love?) in the Weeekly or the Guardian I think. I'm relieved to know that it's not just that I'm not attractive to her or that I don't do things the right way.

However, I'm worried about having this conversation with her. I don't want her to feel stigmatized; I don't want to just tell her that she has a sickness. I'll broach this with the therapist today (my wife can't make it so it will be just me) and see where that goes.

I did find a couple of books on Amazon that address this. When they come I'll find out.

PLEASE, if there is anyone out there, mental health professional, or someone who has dealt with this- please give me some guidance.

[oak]

Agreed with the fine advice of Almost!

I consider Dan Savage's podcast required listening (up there with WTF, Risk!, and of course MIHH).

Mr. Savage has dealt with your same issue, OP.

[Otter]

Thanks to everyone here for your digital support. The past week or so has been incredibly difficult emotionally, but I have come out of it with amazing clarity that has helped me make a new start.

First, thanks for the Dan Savage recommendation. After about 5 minutes of reading archived stuff on the issue it was clear to me that it was NOT about my childhood, or my inability to understand my wife's perspective, or any ignorance of how women feel. This is a universal human experience that happens to almost everyone in this situation, male or female. Dan even rants in one response to a letter on the misaligned sex drive dynamic that he hates letters like that because he gets them SO often. When it happens, he writes, eventually the pain of rejection and isolation mount to a very unhealthy situation. Bam, just like that, I'm not alone and it is a normal reaction to this situation.

After riding an emotional roller coaster for a few days (where I was not getting much sleep, crying at the dinner table and feeling serious anxiety that I could not stop- side note: I now have some idea of what anxiety is like and I really feel for those of you who suffer this on a chronic basis) I had another epiphany; I held my wife, crying my eyes out, and told her that I was not going anywhere no matter what she did, or how she felt. I related her change in libido to a change in sexual orientation. If she told me she was gay tomorrow, or that she was bi or that she wanted to fuck ducks, I would NOT throw her out and make us all miserable, including impacts on the kids that would last a lifetime. Instead, we would make adjustments and allowances in our marriage and continue to provide a loving environment for our kids because I love her so much as a person, not because of anything she does or doesn't do in bed.

By the way, listen to Sex with Ducks by Garfunkel and Oates. Hilarious!

So in this new place, it doesn't matter if she never wants to have sex again, as long as we can make adjustments and allowances in an honest, open way for each other's real human needs, whatever they may be. It's a new start and there's no pressure, no guilt, no judgements. My new standard is that I will do things that promote love & acceptance, and diminish rejection & isolation. It's beautiful!

[MizLzie]

Beautiful. Brought tears to my eyes. Your wife is a lucky person to have someone so supportive & encouraging on her side. Wishing you the best!