YOU ARE NOT ALONE - A companion online community discussion board for The Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast with Paul Gilmartin

Don't get too excited. It was only 60 people.

Study Finds Turmeric Is As Effective As Prozac For Treating Depression
http://www.collective-evolution.com/201 ... epression/

This marks the first published study using a randomized and controlled clinical trial which indicates the efficacy of turmeric (curcumin) in treating serious depression. Results show that turmeric is just as effective as Prozac and possibly more effective than other depression drugs on the market. It is important to note the study does not account for the negative effects (side effects) that come with Prozac. Prozac is known to cause suicidal ideation and/or other psychotic disorders, however, these are not present when treating with turmeric. The use of turmeric as a treatment for depression is safer and less taxing on the body when compared to treatment with pharmaceutical drugs. These results are not surprising given the comparison of synthetic treatments vs natural.

The anti-depressant market reaches annual profits of about $12 billion. This number is expected to increase to $13.5 billion by 2018. These medications do not help cure depressions but instead mask symptoms and create a life long reliance on them. Utilizing natural treatments coupled with a holistic approach of assessing lifestyle, diet and the root cause of depression is an approach that is much more effective both in cost and curing patients. It is important to keep in mind that the pharmaceutical industry is a business before anything else. We are seeing a growing body of evidence to suggest natural treatments are much safer and effective when treating a variety of diseases, disorders and illnesses. It’s time they get more attention.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23832433

found via Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/psychology/comm ... as_prozac/

I just can't let this one slip by --

There is so much wrong with this study I'm not sure where to begin. You're very upfront about the first withdraw - the small sample size of 60 people and fact this is a first trial. There is also the matter of there not being a control group, which is a major problem! Add onto that the fact they were given only 20mg of Prozac and measured only 6 weeks apart and I feel comfortable concluding that this study proves nothing.

The claim that this study finds turmeric is as effective as prozac is false. The study says:

Interestingly, the mean change in HAM-D17 score at the end of six weeks was comparable in all three groups

If anything, this doesn't show the efficacy of Turmeric, but rather the inefficacy of Prozac. But we can't know which for certain because there was no control group.

Also, your insinuating that pharmaceutical industry is just in it for the money is probably true, but holding Prozac up as an example is silly. The patent on Prozac (Fluoxetine) expired well over a decade ago. It's now available (in the USA at least) in several generic forms at very low cost. Prozac (Fluoxetine) is on the value priced generics list of several major pharmacies, such as CVS, Walgreens, Kroger and Walmart for under $5 without insurance.

I'm all for holistic approaches to medicine, but staying away from all pharmaceuticals is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Why not just make lifestyle changes and get medical help? L I see no reason why these things should be mutually exclusive.

A personal anecdote:

I've dealt with depression and anxiety for a long time but unfortunately I grew up in a family that held very ignorant ideas about medicine. It was never: let's do some research, seek out at least a few expert opinions, try this or that and see what happens. Instead it was always fear, fear, fear, fear, fear! Fear of all psychologists, all psychiatrists, all pharmaceuticals, all doctors, all this and all that. And that's the problem, you can't just make sweeping generalizations. As I'm sure anyone can tell you, there are some bad eggs in every basket. The key is knowing how to judge individuals.

I've only recently had the option of seeking medical help because of my family's very negative ideas and all the fear I inherited from them. All through 2013 I decided to try to fight my depression and anxiety with just the resources available to me and I made some good progress. I lost quite a bit of weight, drastically improved my diet, regularly exercised, learned how to meditate, always kept hydrated, started taking a couple of supplements, made sure to get lots of sunlight every day, quit drinking alcohol completely, started reading for fun again, spent more time with positive friends, cut out all the negative ones, and much, much more. The end of that year was much better than the beginning, but it was also clear that I needed more help - so I sought out a psychiatrist and decided to try it.

The first time I met my current psychiatrist, I had a good feeling about him, but I was also really nervous. Well, perhaps more fearful and suspicious than nervous. I can remember sitting in his office, legs tightly together,a little hunched over, hands tangled in each other, making a conscious effort to breathe and overall trying to look normal. By the end of that initial consultation, he had won my trust.

For one, he seemed genuinely interested in my problems and listened to my concerns. I told him that I was only interested in very conservative courses of treatment (not new, fancy drugs) and that money was a bit of an issue. He agreed that it was reasonable and we started with 10mg of fluoxetine which cost me less than $4. He assured me that the generic form of Prozac was just as effective as the name brand and that he had personally seen some very good results with it. He also told me about the serious warnings, all the potential side effects and spent time pointing out ones that were more likely in his experience, such as nausea and fatigue. It was a good thing too because sure enough it made me nauseous and very fatigued. Within a couple of weeks those side effects dissipated and eventually disappeared completely. We've since altered my medication three times and seem to have found the right formulation now, a combination of two different drugs at moderate doses. After each alteration I experienced some negative side effects, but just like that first time they dissipated and eventually disappeared completely.

During that first visit, he also strongly encouraged me to find a therapist who used CBT and wanted to be able to coordinate my treatment with them - an offer I took him up on. My therapist keeps him updated on my overall mood and the progress of my treatment and is always on the lookout for serious warning signs. Fortunately, there haven't been any. He's also corresponded with my primary care doctor about some blood tests I had done, to rule out any other causes of my depression, such as a thyroid malfunction.

CBT has been a huge help from the get go, but getting my meds in order has helped significantly. I feel like I'm making more progress in every session and my therapist agrees. She's already taught me so many things and I look forward to continuing to work with her. I also have a really good relationship with my pharmacist. She's been a resource for quick questions, like whether taking certain supplements will interact with my prescriptions, how important timing is and what to do if I miss a dose, etc.

So you see, your big generalizations can only take you so far, you have to focus on individuals too. Individual doctors, therapists, pharmacists and friends. I can't look Glaxosmithkline in the eyes and tell if it's lying to me, I can't ask it questions or challenge its opinions. But I can do all of those things with the individuals listed above, and that has made all the difference.

I feel confident and comfortable saying that tumeric makes a noticable difference to my mood

Then by all means, take it. I might even try it myself. But I wouldn't stay away from all pharmaceuticals based on the evidence of this study.

The anti-depressant market reaches annual profits of about $12 billion. This number is expected to increase to $13.5 billion by 2018. These medications do not help cure depressions but instead mask symptoms and create a life long reliance on them. Utilizing natural treatments coupled with a holistic approach of assessing lifestyle, diet and the root cause of depression is an approach that is much more effective both in cost and curing patients. It is important to keep in mind that the pharmaceutical industry is a business before anything else. We are seeing a growing body of evidence to suggest natural treatments are much safer and effective when treating a variety of diseases, disorders and illnesses. It’s time they get more attention.

I think taking supplements and changing your lifestyle has a HUGE effect on your depression. I take supplements in conjunction with my meds along with exercise and keeping a healthy lifestyle the best I can. Placebo effects are not to be taken lightly, they are scientifically evidenced (why do you think pharmaceutical companies have to test out their meds so many times to rule out placebo?) Our minds are much more than anything that comes from the outside like meds. I'm not opposed to meds, but I also take the power of belief very seriously. We can't be just relying on outside help and not do the work on the inside and take responsibility. Only we can ultimately change ourselves. I know I deserve my full attention and effort to get better. And I know that with dealing with my own depression, I will be stronger and wiser, however long it takes.

justsomeoneinacorner - I TOTALLY agree. The sample is amazingly small. I hope a bigger study will come out soon. It sucks to even know about it really. You work with your doctor to put you on a medication that you finally works. Then someone says you should try turmeric. Then if you try it. Now you don't know if it's the medication, or the turmeric, or Vitamin D, or fish oil, or stress reduction, or SAD light, or exercise, or medication, or whatever is actually helping. The latest thing I read of using laughing gas can help with severe depression. http://www.webmd.com/depression/news/20 ... depression

Snake Oil Supplements http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/v ... pplements/

I hope someday (in less than 10 years), you'll be able to go to the doctor for a blood test, and an advanced brain scan, and they tell you, "OK. Based on your tests, this is exactly what you should take at this time of the day." or "We've determined we need to inject some stem cells into this part of your brain so it will start correctly managing your hormones. You'll be fixed forever."

Today I heard a saying, "Life is process." I guess after years of struggle with mental health issues, you finally figure it out. I think this is really what "The Mental Illness Happy Hour" is really all about. Paul and the people on his show give us hope, and that what people need. Just like Paul, I am hopeful. I am very grateful for the work Paul is doing.