YOU ARE NOT ALONE - A companion online community discussion board for The Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast with Paul Gilmartin

Hello everyone!

Yesterday I finished reading 'Silently Seduced' by Kenneth Adams after hearing Paul recommending it all the time as a resource to learn more about covert incest. Reading the book made me realise that my father definitely suffered (and still does) from covert incest at least from one of his parents. The realisation was actually a relief and so was reading the 'Silently Seduced' as I finally understood that a lot of the hurtful things my dad does are not just his personality but his trauma. I didn't find a topic in the forum that focused on how covert incest victims parent so I thought I'd pose some questions myself in case someone else was okay with sharing their experiences.

I'd love to know if it's common for covertly incestuous relationships to extend to grandchildren and in which way the relationships between mother/father-son, and grandmother/grandfather-granddaughter may differ. Do some covert incest victims wake up to how dangerous their relationship to their parent is once they have kids of their own? Also I have been wondering if there is anyone else here who knows about covert incest victims who managed to stay in a marriage and in what ways the lasting marriage may be dysfunctional due to the trauma. Finally, the question that is plaguing me the most is how I could try to help my dad see how toxic his relationship to his parents is.

My dad is a really wonderful person in many ways but he has done so much to hurt me and the rest of our family. Discovering the concept of covert incest has helped me understand his actions a little better but I still have so many questions.

Take care everyone!

Louisa

Louisa, thank you for sharing. You raise excellent question. Many very difficult questions, and in this life many of the best questions are difficult ones.

While I don't have any first hand experience with covert incest, I do have varying degrees of experience with the following:

1. Sexual abuse effected on men (need I say that it is minimized, said not to exist, and (paradoxically) celebrated?)
2. Abuse down through the generations.
3. Knowing when to draw hard boundaries.

The answer to each of the above, to the extent that there is an answer (there isn't, at least that I've found) is communication and boundaries.

I wish I had an answer for you.

What specifically, from the book, rang true for you in observing your father over the years?

Hello Louisa,

This is totally outside my realm, and I haven't read the book, but have heard Paul speak about this frequently, since he's experienced it personally.

I thought this behavior was confined to adult-parent to child, no? You indicate adult-to-adult as well?

Maybe Paul knows something about intergenerational dynamics. Maybe he can comment if you email him..

Hi Louisa,

Welcome to the forum. I'm sorry to hear that your family has been so impacted by this issue.

Did you happen to listen to Episode 449 with Tony M.? It deals with covert incest by his parents, and if I remember correctly, Tony discussed the effect on his own marriage and parenting. Tony also posts occasionally on the forum.

Take care and I hope you'll keep posting here.

rivergirl

louisa wrote: ↑February 20th, 2021, 9:11 am Hello everyone!
... <snipped for brevity> ...
Louisa

Hi Louisa! Thank you for sharing. Tony M here from episode 449 (https://mentalpod.com/archives/5499). I had some things happen in my life where I had to take a break from the forums for a while and that turned into just not coming back...until now!

As you will hear in my episode, I grew up in a family where I survived (I don't like the "victim" word) covert incest from my mother. Most of the details are in the episode.

I can say that for my entire life all the way up until I heard about Silently Seduced from Paul, I just had a bad "icky" feeling in my body. I didn't have words to put to it until I read the book and heard lots of people talk about it on Paul's show. By that time I'd already been married for 7 years and a father for 5. My marriage has DEFINITELY been affected by this knowledge. Even to this day I routinely second-guess myself about whether or not I am upset about something my wife does because I'm legitimately upset by her words/actions or if I am "just triggered" by a family of origin issue. It got bad enough during COVID-19 that I temporarily moved out and got a small apartment on my own so that I could focus on healing work in isolation. While we're still married, the effects (the ripples as Paul calls them) are there every single day.

I know this reply is a long time after your original post and you may not even be active here anymore, but I'm open to answering questions from you (or anyone else) if you have them.

Gosh this is so powerful and familiar all at the same time. I’m lost for words. Welcome back TonyM